Skeetendo

’Cause all games were better on the GBC

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#1 2011-02-21 20:51:02

koolboyman
Member
Registered: 2010-10-16
Post 23/203

Pokemon Prism

PLEASE DO NOT ASK ME OR QUESTION WHEN THE NEXT VERSION IS OUT.  I DO NOT KNOW AND I WILL ANNOUNCE THE DATE WHEN I KNOW.

I'm sure you all know about this hack.  I mostly made this topic because I want you to criticize it.  I dunno, maybe I'm too hard on myself.  But my fanboys always think everything I do is absolutely perfect (see www.youtube.com/watch?v=YK5UAZhRWIE ), and I know that isn't true.  I can ALWAYS do better.  So let me know.  What you liked, what you hated, what could be better, etc. I'll really appreciate it.

As for the future of Prism.  It will get done, but it's not my main priority right now (Starting a new indie game group with huge plans).  I have the second quest done (Rijon), I just have to fill in the gaps, which might not be that epic since I kinda want this to get done and over with and move onto making "real games".  Prism's a good warm up though.

Last edited by koolboyman (2013-01-05 04:58:15)

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#2 2011-02-21 21:03:40

Shenaldrac
Member
Registered: 2010-12-10
Post 5/26

Re: Pokemon Prism

Well, I've played it for a bit. Didn't get farther than the Magicarp section because of some glitch that wouldn't allow me to finish the conversation with the guy once I'd beaten it. Pressing A or any buttons didn't advance the script. In fact, if I tried to press select during the section, it would display the text about how an item can be put on select, etc, but again at the end pressing A wouldn't close the text box, and I'd have to load a save state. So unless that's intended as the end of the beta, I think there's a problem.

I was definitely surprised at the change to the beginning, starting out in a forest. I do think it was odd that we're just in a forest now and intentionally walk into a cave. Maybe have a bit of text to explain why we're there? Moving on. When you get to the professor's house and you meet your rival..... I just have to wonder, why is the pokemon that we was just torturing fight for him, and why does it follow him out and accept him as a trainer? Just seems odd to me. And, perhaps I'm just a softy, but I personally didn't really like the change of making the rival suddenly be some kind of complete monster, breaking into a place to kill/torture pokemon. Maybe there's some backstory to it that is going to be explained, but from what little I can see now it just seems like an attempt to gather people for the "Oh wow, so edgy".

The casino... I like the casino. I really do. I'm amazed at what you've managed to do with it. And.... that's all I can think of. Still a fantastic hack as of now, though I wish I could finish the Magicarp section.

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#3 2011-02-21 21:40:45

~Red
Member
Registered: 2010-10-16
Post 90/276

Re: Pokemon Prism

I personally thought Prism was too complicated. You added in many systems such as crafting and mining and I had to refer to guides several times because I couldn't get to grips with it. Also, the encounter rates in Prism are too high, and the trainers are a little too hard.

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#4 2011-02-21 21:58:03

koolboyman
Member
Registered: 2010-10-16
Post 24/203

Re: Pokemon Prism

~Red wrote:

Also, the encounter rates in Prism are too high, and the trainers are a little too hard.

That's funny, because some other people have told me that the trainers are too easy.  And from what I understand, the encounter rates in Prism may seem higher, but its just because you're using running shoes that you run into Pokemon more often.  All the areas have a lower encounter rate than Gold's areas, but have a lot bigger maps.  I might have to lower them a bit more, dunno.

Shenaldrac wrote:

Well, I've played it for a bit. Didn't get farther than the Magicarp section because of some glitch that wouldn't allow me to finish the conversation with the guy once I'd beaten it. Pressing A or any buttons didn't advance the script. In fact, if I tried to press select during the section, it would display the text about how an item can be put on select, etc, but again at the end pressing A wouldn't close the text box, and I'd have to load a save state. So unless that's intended as the end of the beta, I think there's a problem.

Yeah that is a problem.  I've heard of that glitch, but I have not been able to recreate it myself.  If you would send me a sav file or save state or something I could maybe fix it.  But so far, nobody has given me enough information to fix it.

Shenaldrac wrote:

I was definitely surprised at the change to the beginning, starting out in a forest. I do think it was odd that we're just in a forest now and intentionally walk into a cave. Maybe have a bit of text to explain why we're there? Moving on. When you get to the professor's house and you meet your rival..... I just have to wonder, why is the pokemon that we was just torturing fight for him, and why does it follow him out and accept him as a trainer? Just seems odd to me. And, perhaps I'm just a softy, but I personally didn't really like the change of making the rival suddenly be some kind of complete monster, breaking into a place to kill/torture pokemon. Maybe there's some backstory to it that is going to be explained, but from what little I can see now it just seems like an attempt to gather people for the "Oh wow, so edgy".

Yeah more of a backstory would be nice.  I left it vague so the player could make their own ideas of who this person is and where he is.  Funny thing is, someone complained that I gave "Too much information" since the previous beta, where you started in the cave instead of a forest.

I think I went a little too far with the rival, but he does have a back story, so he isn't completely insane for no reason.  He had a really rough childhood. I just thought the usual rivals were too tame, so I wanted a more "Extreme" approach.

The reason the Pokemon fought for the rival is because if it didn't, the rival might hurt/kill the Pokemon.  I know it sounds a bit weird, but this is Pokemon.  A world where you inflict pain on innocent wild creatures, "catch them" and they obey your every command no questions asked unless you don't have a badge and it's too strong.

Shenaldrac wrote:

The casino... I like the casino. I really do. I'm amazed at what you've managed to do with it. And.... that's all I can think of. Still a fantastic hack as of now, though I wish I could finish the Magicarp section.

Thanks for the comments.  I'll consider them all when working on the new version.  I know I can't please everyone, but I want to do my best.

Last edited by koolboyman (2011-02-21 22:13:28)

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#5 2011-02-22 00:25:54

Shenaldrac
Member
Registered: 2010-12-10
Post 6/26

Re: Pokemon Prism

As for the pokemon fighting for him: What you say makes sense, I hadn't thought about it like that. Still sucks that after you win you can't tell him to just GTFO and save the pokemon, but then I guess that adds to things a bit; trying to beat him in the future to recover the stolen pokemon. It does kinda feel like a Pyrrhic victory when you beat him and he still manages to get away with the poor pokemon. I'm glad to hear that there will be more to be heard from on the rival to explain his harshness and cruelty, though personally I'd still tone it down a little.

I've be happy to send you a save state/file. I'm using a mac though, so not sure if it'd be compatible with what you use. Just let me know how/where to send though and I'd be more than happy to.

Edit: I think the reason that it's thought of as too much information about how you start is because in the previous version, you start in media res. Yes we don't know how we got to the cave, but with no way out but forward we go on, and at I think a subconscious level accept that we'll be told later. By contrast, starting in the forest makes you wonder "Why am I going into the cave?" Before, you were in the cave. The mine cart was broken. It makes sense that you want to get out, indeed it's the only thing you'd be able to do. But outside, in a forest, you start to wonder "Why am I in the forest? Who am I?". Such questions get put on the back burner when you've got a goal (Get out of cave), but without the immediate sense of urgency that being trapped in a cave brings, the mind can wander and think about stuff.

Last edited by Shenaldrac (2011-02-22 00:31:56)

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#6 2011-02-22 05:24:24

koolboyman
Member
Registered: 2010-10-16
Post 25/203

Re: Pokemon Prism

Shenaldrac wrote:

I've be happy to send you a save state/file. I'm using a mac though, so not sure if it'd be compatible with what you use. Just let me know how/where to send though and I'd be more than happy to.

That shouldn't be an issue.  Just send whatever you have to coolboyman@gmail.com and I'll look into it.  Thanks!

Last edited by koolboyman (2011-02-22 05:24:32)

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#7 2011-02-22 06:39:45

Shenaldrac
Member
Registered: 2010-12-10
Post 7/26

Re: Pokemon Prism

koolboyman wrote:

That shouldn't be an issue.  Just send whatever you have to coolboyman@gmail.com and I'll look into it.  Thanks!

Email away!

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#8 2011-02-22 17:50:01

tekcoR
Member
From: Celadon City
Registered: 2010-10-16
Post 37/165

Re: Pokemon Prism

I found the trainers strength pleasant. It became easier with the late-game.
However, the encounter rate in the Haunted Forest was really annoying. Usually, I play GBC hacks with Double speed on Lameboy and it was still too much.

Nevertheless, the hack is great.

Last edited by tekcoR (2011-02-22 17:50:30)


Cya

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#9 2011-02-25 16:57:42

Miksy91
Member
Registered: 2010-10-16
Post 294/2,339

Re: Pokemon Prism

As for myself, I can't think of much critic to give.
It's quite a long time since I finished the latest beta you released.
But for the good things: I liked the side-quests and the new graphics.
You made lots of scripts that separate this hack from original G/S/C games - I think that's a good thing but maybe there are even too much of those???

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#10 2011-02-26 07:10:47

koolboyman
Member
Registered: 2010-10-16
Post 26/203

Re: Pokemon Prism

Miksy91 wrote:

As for myself, I can't think of much critic to give.
It's quite a long time since I finished the latest beta you released.
But for the good things: I liked the side-quests and the new graphics.
You made lots of scripts that separate this hack from original G/S/C games - I think that's a good thing but maybe there are even too much of those???

Like I told other people, if you like the stuff in G/S/C, play those games, because Prism is not gold.  But honestly, Prism is used as an outlet for me to experiment with.  To see what works and what doesn't.  I love developing games, and I hope I can work for a professional video game company one day (or make my own, because for the most part I don't agree with the direction of the modern video game industry).   

tekcoR wrote:

I found the trainers strength pleasant. It became easier with the late-game.
However, the encounter rate in the Haunted Forest was really annoying. Usually, I play GBC hacks with Double speed on Lameboy and it was still too much.

Nevertheless, the hack is great.

I'll look into that rate later, that might have been my bad.

Last edited by koolboyman (2011-02-26 08:51:39)

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#11 2011-02-27 11:10:23

Cloud
Member
Registered: 2010-12-18
Post 129/302

Re: Pokemon Prism

Well, I noticed a minor bug when tryng to cacth every new pokemon in this beta today. At night, there are no wild encounter in route 71 and 72. Remembering that Gold map have a bug that make it like this.... Check your e-mail,please.

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#12 2011-02-27 13:34:18

Miksy91
Member
Registered: 2010-10-16
Post 301/2,339

Re: Pokemon Prism

Cloud wrote:

Well, I noticed a minor bug when tryng to cacth every new pokemon in this beta today. At night, there are no wild encounter in route 71 and 72. Remembering that Gold map have a bug that make it like this.... Check your e-mail,please.

It's not about goldmap, the wild pokemon encounters don't "want" to be edited.
It doesn't matter which tool you use to do it, the encounter rate bytes seem to want to change to 00's for some reason.

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#13 2011-02-27 14:24:54

Cloud
Member
Registered: 2010-12-18
Post 131/302

Re: Pokemon Prism

Miksy91 wrote:
Cloud wrote:

Well, I noticed a minor bug when tryng to cacth every new pokemon in this beta today. At night, there are no wild encounter in route 71 and 72. Remembering that Gold map have a bug that make it like this.... Check your e-mail,please.

It's not about goldmap, the wild pokemon encounters don't "want" to be edited.
It doesn't matter which tool you use to do it, the encounter rate bytes seem to want to change to 00's for some reason.

Really? I never encountered any problem like this since i use Megamap to edit the map and connections.

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#14 2011-02-27 17:01:52

koolboyman
Member
Registered: 2010-10-16
Post 27/203

Re: Pokemon Prism

I fixed the encounter problems in an earlier update.  That bug's pretty annoying, but I guess thats the price to pay for Goldmap...

The Goldmap I use is a Modified version of Goldmap so it works with Prism.  Regular Goldmap and megamap won't be able to edit Prism successfully.

Last edited by koolboyman (2011-02-27 17:02:47)

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#15 2011-02-27 23:51:02

Shenaldrac
Member
Registered: 2010-12-10
Post 9/26

Re: Pokemon Prism

I just remembered my biggest gripe about this hack, and Brown as well. Don't know how I forgot.

The addition of new types is interesting, and new moves are always welcome, but adding 3-5 new types without actually adding enough moves to be able to effectively exploit said types just makes it feel like there's no point. Making a type like Abnormal especially is rough on anyone who gets a Porygon 2 in Brown, and why make Tri attack its own type? There goes sTAB from it for Dodrio and Proygon. Also, maybe it's just me but I was never able to get the typing down too well, as in which types are good against others. WEll, aside from Abnormal being weak to normal, that I got right quick. But yeah, I think that if you're going to add new types and change existing pokemon, then you should add in some more moves of those types to make it so that pokemon can take advantage of their new type. Some of them just don't seem all that different and necessary; do we really need wood and gas in addition to grass and poison?

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#16 2011-02-28 14:14:23

Sawakita
Administrator
Registered: 2010-10-16
Post 89/365

Re: Pokemon Prism

It seems that you have messed up the whole "SGB-Feature System":

bgb00002.png bgb00003.png bgb00004.png

You might want to fix it, or at least edit the ROM Header, where it defines whether it's a SGB-compatible ROM or not.

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#17 2011-02-28 21:07:17

koolboyman
Member
Registered: 2010-10-16
Post 28/203

Re: Pokemon Prism

Shenaldrac wrote:

I just remembered my biggest gripe about this hack, and Brown as well. Don't know how I forgot.

The addition of new types is interesting, and new moves are always welcome, but adding 3-5 new types without actually adding enough moves to be able to effectively exploit said types just makes it feel like there's no point. Making a type like Abnormal especially is rough on anyone who gets a Porygon 2 in Brown, and why make Tri attack its own type? There goes sTAB from it for Dodrio and Proygon. Also, maybe it's just me but I was never able to get the typing down too well, as in which types are good against others. WEll, aside from Abnormal being weak to normal, that I got right quick. But yeah, I think that if you're going to add new types and change existing pokemon, then you should add in some more moves of those types to make it so that pokemon can take advantage of their new type. Some of them just don't seem all that different and necessary; do we really need wood and gas in addition to grass and poison?

Two main reasons I added these new types in: To make the type table more balanced, and to allow people to strategize a little differently than the official games.  It wasn't just "Hey look I can add in brand new types!", there WAS some thought process behind these.  However I agree that why should Wood exist is Grass exists? I however think Wind, Sound, and Abnormal are good types. It was difficult to choose which new types I could add in when working on that.

You are absolutely right that most people don't fully understand the new types.  I've gotten a few messages people claiming "glitch in brown" because a normal attack was super effective against Porygon. Perhaps I should present the type table in game somewhere so people can understand everything.  What other new types would you think would be more acceptable? 

I don't think that would be a problem with Tri Attack because it gives them a unique type to attack with, and there are other moves they can use that are normal AND more powerful than Tri Attack. But that's just me.  I made the tri type basically attack based on the average of Fire/Electric/Ice against the enemy.  For example, attack pidgey with it, it would do 4x damage because Pidgey is weak to both ice and electric, Bellsprout gets 2x damage because its weak to both fire and ice, but is strong against electric. 2 * 2 * .5 = 2  It just felt too weird to me being a "normal" attack when it's clearly not.

I also realized that there's not enough moves for various types, so I'm going to add in 20 new attack that will all be related to the new types next version. 

Thank you for the critique! 

Sawakita wrote:

It seems that you have messed up the whole "SGB-Feature System":

http://img824.imageshack.us/img824/3387/bgb00002.png http://img703.imageshack.us/img703/9647/bgb00003.png http://img545.imageshack.us/img545/1760/bgb00004.png

You might want to fix it, or at least edit the ROM Header, where it defines whether it's a SGB-compatible ROM or not.

Forgot to do that!  I'll fix it up later, thanks.

Last edited by koolboyman (2011-02-28 21:21:11)

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#18 2011-03-01 01:10:18

Shenaldrac
Member
Registered: 2010-12-10
Post 10/26

Re: Pokemon Prism

koolboyman wrote:

Two main reasons I added these new types in: To make the type table more balanced, and to allow people to strategize a little differently than the official games.  It wasn't just "Hey look I can add in brand new types!", there WAS some thought process behind these.  However I agree that why should Wood exist is Grass exists? I however think Wind, Sound, and Abnormal are good types. It was difficult to choose which new types I could add in when working on that.

You are absolutely right that most people don't fully understand the new types.  I've gotten a few messages people claiming "glitch in brown" because a normal attack was super effective against Porygon. Perhaps I should present the type table in game somewhere so people can understand everything.  What other new types would you think would be more acceptable? 

I don't think that would be a problem with Tri Attack because it gives them a unique type to attack with, and there are other moves they can use that are normal AND more powerful than Tri Attack. But that's just me.  I made the tri type basically attack based on the average of Fire/Electric/Ice against the enemy.  For example, attack pidgey with it, it would do 4x damage because Pidgey is weak to both ice and electric, Bellsprout gets 2x damage because its weak to both fire and ice, but is strong against electric. 2 * 2 * .5 = 2  It just felt too weird to me being a "normal" attack when it's clearly not.

I also realized that there's not enough moves for various types, so I'm going to add in 20 new attack that will all be related to the new types next version. 

Thank you for the critique!

Wind, Sound and Abnormal do sound pretty good to have. I'd say the biggest thing is to make sure that there's stuff in game that specifically mentions these types and what they are strong/weak against. Maybe have a trainer talk about his Porygon/Jigglypuff (assuming Jigglypuff is sound, I'm not sure). As for new types.... I can't really think of any at the moment. I think the base+Sound, Wind and Abnormal are enough. And Tri Attack works like that? Wow, yeah, that's VERY nice. I did not know that, like, at all. Gonna have to go replay Brown now! But, again, that's probably the kind of thing that deserves mention so people understand it. Or maybe Dodrio Tri-type..... What? I like Dodrio.

Glad to hear that you'll be putting in more attacks for the custom types, and I'm more than happy to help!

Edit: Oh, for new moves; maybe add even more moves for existing types, like Ghost and Dragon? Well, maybe not Dragon, but in 2nd gen iirc Ghosts have only Lick and Shadow Ball for direct-damage moves.

Last edited by Shenaldrac (2011-03-01 01:14:07)

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#19 2011-03-01 03:03:44

Cloud
Member
Registered: 2010-12-18
Post 141/302

Re: Pokemon Prism

Edit: Oh, for new moves; maybe add even more moves for existing types, like Ghost and Dragon? Well, maybe not Dragon, but in 2nd gen iirc Ghosts have only Lick and Shadow Ball for direct-damage moves.

Also, Dark type only have Bite, Chrunch, Pursuit and Faint Attack if I'm remember.

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#20 2011-04-24 13:25:41

eL_Ruzman
Member
Registered: 2011-04-24
Post 2/17

Re: Pokemon Prism

Download link at rijon.com not latest. Where i can found the latest version? Btw repel effect doesn't work. It too bad 4 me.

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#21 2011-06-10 21:05:49

julio master92
Member
Registered: 2011-06-02
Post 13/48

Re: Pokemon Prism

and what about the full version, cause the one I have played was only a beta with 4 gym leaders.

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#22 2011-06-10 21:40:03

Mateo
Member
From: The Sims 4
Registered: 2009-11-25
Post 710/3,578

Re: Pokemon Prism

I dont think there is a full version yet mate.

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#23 2011-06-30 07:31:32

bleedpark
New member
From: Saint Louis, MO.
Registered: 2011-03-31
Post 2/2

Re: Pokemon Prism

i know ur looking for critics but i played ur game to the end of the 2010 beta, and i loved it. when i realized i reached the end i was almost in tears. u are a little to hard on yourself. the game is amazing.

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#24 2011-09-16 21:02:38

ittalocarvalho
Member
Registered: 2011-08-17
Post 8/14

Re: Pokemon Prism

their loved this hack, even! played summer 2010 beta version, not yet worth it is completed.
I wanted to know what program you used to change the attacks of the Pokemon?

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#25 2011-09-19 07:39:24

gabinmantap
New member
From: indonesia
Registered: 2011-08-22
Post 5/5

Re: Pokemon Prism

hey koolboyman... whne latest version realished..???

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