Skeetendo

’Cause all games were better on the GBC

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#1 2011-06-27 07:57:07

Lin
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Registered: 2011-06-27
Post 1/12

Johtomap

Cheestendo wrote:

but i don't use johtomap (cause it sucks,fucks up my events)

This hurts me. I fail to see how you find GoldMap any better, since JohtoMap does a lot more things (/correctly) than GoldMap. Of course, if the issue posted below your post is true, then there's a bug I, nor anyone else (until now), caught and notified me of to actually fix. JohtoMap was only re-released once for a simple bug fix I caught after releasing the original version, assuming the rest was good. Because it has a bug (or what seems like two) doesn't necessarily mean it sucks. Perhaps if you had reported the issue you wouldn't have had any trouble.

Last edited by Lin (2011-06-27 07:58:12)

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#2 2011-06-27 08:29:31

Miksy91
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Registered: 2010-10-16
Post 445/2,339

Re: Johtomap

Lin wrote:
Cheestendo wrote:

but i don't use johtomap (cause it sucks,fucks up my events)

This hurts me. I fail to see how you find GoldMap any better, since JohtoMap does a lot more things (/correctly) than GoldMap. Of course, if the issue posted below your post is true, then there's a bug I, nor anyone else (until now), caught and notified me of to actually fix. JohtoMap was only re-released once for a simple bug fix I caught after releasing the original version, assuming the rest was good. Because it has a bug (or what seems like two) doesn't necessarily mean it sucks. Perhaps if you had reported the issue you wouldn't have had any trouble.

I thought I had reported this bug a long time ago in your thread in pc but I just checked it out and no, I never did :O
Instead, I only reported a minor bug about repointing:
You can't manually choose the offset where you want to repoint data (when editing Secodary Map Header).

Anyway, there is more.

There is a possibility of editing the "Palette" of each person.
However, as you can see in Scripting Compendium (you probably already know this but yeah...)

Color|Function:


The byte is split in 2x 4 bit.
The first 4 bits determine the color.

The second  half of 4 bits determine the function:

00 = Regular script event
01 = Give item
02 = Trainer

After you click "Save" after editing a map, the [Color|Function] bytes of each person in that map turn out like this, X0.
That's why "people events get messed up".

Right now, the game displays the "Palette" of each person in the map as: 0, 1, 2, 3,..., F.
If you changed it so that you could modify the byte as a whole, it would be awesome :)



Map Connection bug


It's probably only I who have noticed this but anyways...
Johtomap doesn't have the possibility of changing "Pointer to "Connection Strip"s Upperleft Block (Connected Map)".
Instead, the editor decides it itself - it's hard to tell how the coding for this works but everytime I change the map connections with johtomap and save the map, those two bytes turn into some value that the editor wants them to be (although it's not always right).


P.S
Just saying that his editor, already at its current state, far exceeds what Goldmap can do.
It's better at every state: shows script pointers like the way a great editor should, you're able to check what sprites belong to the spriteset of that bank and edit them, shows pictures of each person in the map, warp points... etc.


Still a couple of enhancement suggestions:
-You're not able to edit the collision data of the tiles straight so it could for example show the offset where the collision data of the edited tile is located.
-Perhaps some documentations about "Facing & Movement" ?

Last edited by Miksy91 (2011-06-27 08:43:16)

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#3 2011-06-27 09:30:16

Lin
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Registered: 2011-06-27
Post 2/12

Re: Johtomap

First off, I do apologize for thread hijacking. This really isn't the best place to discuss JohtoMap's state.

Alright Miksy91, you're right - JohtoMap only saves the left nybble of the palette/type byte. You'll have to forgive me - when I made JohtoMap, I spent little time figuring out data structures and mainly was in it for the programming. I never did use JohtoMap beyond testing. As for the connection editor, I made that before I knew anything about assembly and debugging - two things I use heavily now when looking into games like the Zelda Oracles. I also looked into the code for connection saving, I think you're talking about the first 2 bytes after the map/bank, correct? If so, JohtoMap automatically writes those. I thought I had them right, but I guess I never perfected the formula. Sorry about that, I had no idea it was wrong. Next release I'll make it optional if I don't look into it.

If you know C# or understand programming at all (it's pretty simple), here's the code for writing the connections. Back then my knowledge on binary/hexadecimal stuff wasn't at good as it was now and my methods of programming weren't as efficient as they could have be, so I did things like storing pointers in byte arrays rather than a short and ANDing by FF/shifting right 8, so you'll have to excuse those mistakes.

http://pastebin.com/LNBXXh1p

I don't really know anything about the face/movement; like I said, I didn't really look into the games to hack them; I was in it for the programming. If you know anything like formulas for connections that I could implement into JohtoMap, I'd gladly add them in 1.02.

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#4 2011-06-27 09:33:16

Cheestendo
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Registered: 2011-03-30
Post 210/319

Re: Johtomap

aha Lin i'm sorry , but yeah it does bug up the event . but now i see that it ain't that bad , cause goldmap bugged up even more then johto map.
and i don't want to read what miksy wrote , but probably he wrote that. you need to those 2 missing (things or whatever) that need for map connection editing.

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#5 2011-06-27 12:34:57

Miksy91
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Registered: 2010-10-16
Post 447/2,339

Re: Johtomap

Lin wrote:

Alright Miksy91, you're right - JohtoMap only saves the left nybble of the palette/type byte. You'll have to forgive me - when I made JohtoMap, I spent little time figuring out data structures and mainly was in it for the programming. I never did use JohtoMap beyond testing. As for the connection editor, I made that before I knew anything about assembly and debugging - two things I use heavily now when looking into games like the Zelda Oracles. I also looked into the code for connection saving, I think you're talking about the first 2 bytes after the map/bank, correct? If so, JohtoMap automatically writes those. I thought I had them right, but I guess I never perfected the formula. Sorry about that, I had no idea it was wrong. Next release I'll make it optional if I don't look into it.

Yeah, I was talking about the two bytes after map no./bank.
Anyway, I believe I know what's the problem.

This far, I've finished a couple of map connections and the editor writes those two bytes correctly in the following one.
"There is a map connection from map A to map B.
The map connection data from map A to map B begins in the most upper-left block in map B.
In that occasion, the editor calculates the "connection strip..." pointer for the map connection of map A correctly".

However, with other occasions, which don't begin at any corner, the "connection strip..." pointer is calculated wrong.
It still happens to lead to the corner of the map.

I guess you could just take it out.
Map connection editing is kinda hard so if you can do it, you're able to define those two bytes as well :)

Last edited by Miksy91 (2011-06-27 12:38:19)

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#6 2011-06-27 17:04:39

Mateo
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From: The Sims 4
Registered: 2009-11-25
Post 750/3,578

Re: Johtomap

Just contribute my point of view to this, my opinion on using an editor is this: I use whichever one gives me less errors consistently, and I will still avoid using things with bugs that I feel are too much of a hassle. I use Goldmap 1.6 because it works at what it does. I pretty much never run into problems with Goldmap 1.6 unless I myself do something wrong. Goldmap 1.7 on the other hand, added the ability to edit fly-to data for towns. That's great and all, except it saves them wrong. In my opinion, this is enough to make me not use it because it means I have to manually go in and fix any map with fly-to data that I edit. I know how to, but that is beside the point. I shouldn't have to change it manually if I wasn't changing it at all to begin with.

This is my same opinion when it comes to Johto map. Sure it has some nice features, I will give you that. But in my opinion, having to go in and manually fix every trainer and item ball in another editor (whether that is Goldmap or a Hex Editor) is not worth it to me when I could use Goldmap to begin with and have them still work. I have no problem with translating my pointer in to decimal to put them in with goldmap if it means events still work when I save them. But then again, I don't use script editors either, I do all my scripting manually in a hex editor. Because when score_under announced support for gold version, I saw posts commenting that it didn't work right all the time and would occasionally chop off the end of scripts for no reason. And I said "I'll keep doing it by hand, because at least I know that works. If I get a bug that way, I look back over my code and fix it. If the editor decided to compile wrong or save to the wrong area, I'm just screwed".

Basically, I feel an editor is there to make your life easier. If it makes your job more difficult by having to redo something, it is not worth using routinely yet. If the bug with saving events is fixed, as well as the bug with connection data, I would probably make the switch to JohtoMap. But as it is, I stick with Goldmap and a hex editor. I mean no offense to Lin, after all I know how frustrating it is to find a nd fix bugs in your program, and I've never even attempted an editor as complicated as a map editor with all the features JohtoMap has. I just want to say that I can see where Cheesetendo was coming from in not wanting to use it because it "fucks up my events" as he put it.

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#7 2011-06-27 18:46:04

Miksy91
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Registered: 2010-10-16
Post 452/2,339

Re: Johtomap

I see you've got a point there and it's understandable why you don't want to use it.
Well, I prefer it myself though as I've noticed what it does wrong and have found out a way to fix the glitches fast.

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#8 2011-06-28 05:40:12

229/703

Re: Johtomap

Mateo wrote:

Just contribute my point of view to this, my opinion on using an editor is this: I use whichever one gives me less errors consistently, and I will still avoid using things with bugs that I feel are too much of a hassle. I use Goldmap 1.6 because it works at what it does. I pretty much never run into problems with Goldmap 1.6 unless I myself do something wrong. Goldmap 1.7 on the other hand, added the ability to edit fly-to data for towns. That's great and all, except it saves them wrong. In my opinion, this is enough to make me not use it because it means I have to manually go in and fix any map with fly-to data that I edit. I know how to, but that is beside the point. I shouldn't have to change it manually if I wasn't changing it at all to begin with.

Don’t we have the source code for Goldmap? Frankly, I’m surprised nobody’s fixed the bugs, especially that annoying obviously mislabeled textbox. Maybe it’s because it’s written in Delphi, which nobody actually uses anymore.

Mateo wrote:

Basically, I feel an editor is there to make your life easier. If it makes your job more difficult by having to redo something, it is not worth using routinely yet.

Exactly right. But if the author is still around, it’s nice to mention it to him in hopes of getting the bug fixed. Basically,

Using a (good) working program > hex editing > using a severely buggy program

(Of course, this assumes that the program is actually useful. For example, a TM editor with 50 comboboxes would be just dumb.)

Also, I really wish more people would release the source to their programs. That way if they ever become inactive, someone else is free to fix it instead. I suspect the reason it didn’t work in Goldmap’s case was because of the insane choice of language (granted, at the time there was little to choose from in the Windows world). And at least it led to derivatives for other games—I think Pokémap, Redmap and Pikamap were based on it.

Last edited by IIMarckus (2011-06-28 13:35:41)

#9 2011-06-28 06:40:24

pkmgoldfan
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Registered: 2011-02-27
Post 13/51

Re: Johtomap

Sorry to ask but how do you fix a item ball when its screwed up in goldmap?

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#10 2011-06-28 06:42:27

Mateo
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From: The Sims 4
Registered: 2009-11-25
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Re: Johtomap

I have the source to Goldmap, and I was gonna try to edit it to fix that, but the problems were: lack of an editor, and lack of knowledge of Delphi. I figure if i could have gotten a development program that worked, I could have figured out something simple like relabeling a textbox and making it display in hex and whatnot. But as it was it didn't happen.

Also, agreed. It is best to let people know if the creator is still around and try to get them fixed. And a working editor is definitely better than a hex editor. I can edit maps in a hex editor, but if that was all I had to do it with life would suck. So I definitely agree with you on all that.

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#11 2011-06-28 07:12:17

Lin
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Registered: 2011-06-27
Post 3/12

Re: Johtomap

kkj1116 wrote:

I like JohtoMap except I think it could be a little more finalized..

1. Like when I edit a map and change to look at another, my progress goes away. Maybe a box to ask if you are going to save that, no save, or cancel?
2. I changed the music of few maps.. I clicked cancel, but it acted like OK. When I came back the music was changed although I pressed cancel.
3. When I changed the music, the map connections were messed up.. I could not come back from Route to City.

I hope JohtoMap keeps getting updated with new features.

Believe me, I care about adding to JohtoMap as much as I care about the new Pokemon games - not at all. It will probably never have any more features, and if the next release is bug-free, I'll probably just release the code along with it because I really don't plan on adding anything to it except bug fixes. Part of the reason I haven't released the source code yet is because I don't want people to learn from it, and I wasn't sure if I would've picked it up again or not. The code is not 100% efficient and could be done a lot better and I know people would base their code off it if they didn't know what they were doing because I used to do the same thing.

As for the second bug, I blame that on the fact that back then I didn't know objects didn't clone when not passed by the ref keyword. The map was directly modified when editing the border tile, music index, and map type. Those features should have always saved regardless of whether or not you pressed Cancel (Although obviously it wasn't intentional). It's now fixed.

For the third issue, I'm guessing it has to do with JohtoMap's auto-calculating of part of the connection. They get saved when the header is written, which is when you'd do something like change the music, and if part of the connection writing isn't right, well then that poses an issue.

So right now I GUESS the only things to add are 100% connection editing and the ability to edit the right nybble of the palette/type byte. Once those are added I'll re-release it and include the source code. Thanks for the reports guys.

EDIT: I think I fixed the issues mentioned. Things seem to be saving properly and hopefully by little testing was effective. Rather than releasing it officially, I'd appreciate some testing from you guys since you can actually find bugs better than I can. http://www.mediafire.com/?yu0qmo8zehh0ad1 It is pretty late here, so forgive me if I forgot to change some old code to work with the new code, although everything should work fine.

Last edited by Lin (2011-06-28 10:00:52)

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#12 2011-06-28 12:11:00

Cartmic
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Registered: 2010-10-16
Post 51/156

Re: Johtomap

IIMarckus wrote:

...And at least it led to derivatives for other games—I think Pokémap, Redmap, and Pikamap were all based on it.

Pokémap was written separately in VB before Goldmap.

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#13 2011-06-28 12:33:35

Miksy91
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Registered: 2010-10-16
Post 455/2,339

Re: Johtomap

Lin wrote:

I think I fixed the issues mentioned. Things seem to be saving properly and hopefully by little testing was effective. Rather than releasing it officially, I'd appreciate some testing from you guys since you can actually find bugs better than I can. http://www.mediafire.com/?yu0qmo8zehh0ad1 It is pretty late here, so forgive me if I forgot to change some old code to work with the new code, although everything should work fine.

Awesome, I'll test it out and see if it works fine :)

Edit:
Didn't find any more bugs with the editor, seems to work fine to me :)

Anyways, I see you put in another "box" for choosing the "CSUBP" and a "calculator" for it.
I think it's okay that you can calculate it with the editor because it doesn't forestall anything but just saying that you could also check how the values, it calculates, match to the original values of map connections in the game.

For example for Route 1:
Up - CSUBP = 6D9C (calculator = 6D68)
Down - CSUBP = 5497 (calculator = 5497)


The editor seems to calculate the "CSUBP" right if the connection starts at the same "height".
This for example works for the connection between Pallet Town and Route 1 because the width of the connection in both maps is the width of the both maps (=the connection starts in both maps at (0, y) and ends at (10, y) & the width of the both maps is 10).
For example for Viridian City, the connection in Route 1's side is still from (0,0) to (10,0) but in Viridian City's side from (x,y) to (x + width, y))

Not sure how much this explanation tells though :DD

Last edited by Miksy91 (2011-06-28 13:04:29)

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#14 2011-06-28 16:24:46

Cheestendo
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Registered: 2011-03-30
Post 220/319

Re: Johtomap

wow! if there ain't anymore bugs , then it's time to say goodbye to goldmap :D

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#15 2011-06-28 18:19:42

Mateo
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From: The Sims 4
Registered: 2009-11-25
Post 755/3,578

Re: Johtomap

Cartmic wrote:
IIMarckus wrote:

...And at least it led to derivatives for other games—I think Pokémap, Redmap, and Pikamap were all based on it.

Pokémap was written separately in VB before Goldmap.

Indeed, I may be wrong but I think Pokemap was written before Gold and Silver were even released internationally. However Redmap and Pikamap are the exact same program as Goldmap, with custom tileset images and ini files to load the information from red. These versions do not support events though last time i checked because they are in a different format in red than gold.

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#16 2011-06-28 20:58:53

Lin
Member
Registered: 2011-06-27
Post 4/12

Re: Johtomap

Miksy91 wrote:
Lin wrote:

I think I fixed the issues mentioned. Things seem to be saving properly and hopefully by little testing was effective. Rather than releasing it officially, I'd appreciate some testing from you guys since you can actually find bugs better than I can. http://www.mediafire.com/?yu0qmo8zehh0ad1 It is pretty late here, so forgive me if I forgot to change some old code to work with the new code, although everything should work fine.

Awesome, I'll test it out and see if it works fine :)

Edit:
Didn't find any more bugs with the editor, seems to work fine to me :)

Anyways, I see you put in another "box" for choosing the "CSUBP" and a "calculator" for it.
I think it's okay that you can calculate it with the editor because it doesn't forestall anything but just saying that you could also check how the values, it calculates, match to the original values of map connections in the game.

For example for Route 1:
Up - CSUBP = 6D9C (calculator = 6D68)
Down - CSUBP = 5497 (calculator = 5497)


The editor seems to calculate the "CSUBP" right if the connection starts at the same "height".
This for example works for the connection between Pallet Town and Route 1 because the width of the connection in both maps is the width of the both maps (=the connection starts in both maps at (0, y) and ends at (10, y) & the width of the both maps is 10).
For example for Viridian City, the connection in Route 1's side is still from (0,0) to (10,0) but in Viridian City's side from (x,y) to (x + width, y))

Not sure how much this explanation tells though :DD

The formula I use doesn't take the alignments into consideration, which is probably a problem. Oh well though, I'm not going to go dig into it and figure out a real one. Thanks for testing. Source code: http://www.mediafire.com/?ax231k5r84uaos9

Last edited by Lin (2011-06-28 21:08:01)

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#17 2011-06-29 00:47:08

230/703

Re: Johtomap

Thanks, I’ve mirrored it here (and ClassicMap here).

Now, where’s the source for ZOLE? ;)

Last edited by IIMarckus (2011-07-11 04:43:30)

#18 2011-06-29 10:15:44

Lin
Member
Registered: 2011-06-27
Post 5/12

Re: Johtomap

IIMarckus wrote:

Thanks, I’ve mirrored it here.

Now, where’s the source for ZOLE? ;)

Probably won't get released until ZOLE is completely finished :P I don't want other versions of it floating around the internet as long as it's still active.

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#19 2011-07-11 11:05:55

Cheestendo
Member
Registered: 2011-03-30
Post 260/319

Re: Johtomap

Good day, I have this weird error coming up.
''The application failed to initialize properly (0xc0000135). Click on OK to terminate the application.''
Do you know what is the problem and how to fix it?

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#20 2011-09-11 22:57:52

Munchulax
Member
From: Somewhere in Johto
Registered: 2011-08-10
Post 5/410

Re: Johtomap

The problem is that you do not have the .NET Framework 2.0 installed, you can download it here: http://www.microsoft.com/download/en/de … px?id=1639


“To live is the rarest thing in the world. Most people exist, that is all.” ― Oscar Wilde

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#21 2011-11-07 01:11:17

tysonrss
Member
From: US, Ohio
Registered: 2011-08-27
Post 57/649

Re: Johtomap

Well I gave this a shot and I like that it can insert OW's(I've yet to try anything else yet).

Are the pointer errors corrected? Or still going strong?


Pokemon Blue DX is reborn!

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#22 2011-12-27 20:49:05

Munchulax
Member
From: Somewhere in Johto
Registered: 2011-08-10
Post 80/410

Re: Johtomap

kkj1116 wrote:

There's two topics under JohtoMap and there's one link for the version with bug fixes.
I think it'd be helpful for future users if the mods created a new thread or got rid of the other one and added the most recent version's download link to the first post (I just found out an issue I was having with map connections was due to using an older version).

I had that problem too.  I was talking about it in my Pokemon Golden thread.


“To live is the rarest thing in the world. Most people exist, that is all.” ― Oscar Wilde

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